Author Topic: Stop.... It's hammer time: New power hammer!  (Read 16177 times)

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Offline Twilight Fenrir

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Re: Stop.... It's hammer time: New power hammer!
« Reply #30 on: August 09, 2016, 06:46:22 AM »
Fenrir,

I have in the past used a router with a board mounted in place of the base to give more area and a mounted wheel(like you get in the harbor freight die grinders) with a flat bottom to sit on top of the hammer base and grind back and forth to smooth the bottom of the dovetail out. It is very slow and tedius work but it does clean it up pretty well. I have not tried JB weld so I can't say about it.

Im not sure about the pin in the helve but I think there shoould be something to hold it in place!

Bill D.
That's kind of brilliant! Haha, I'll keep that in mind. I figure the JB SHOULD work alright.... There's more cast iron the right height than there will be JB. The JB may be more compressible, but it will have to get through the rest of the cast before it starts deforming the JB...  In theory...

I asked the guy who restored his, and he said that is the one part he never had off. But, that it looks like it was somehow riveted together... The bump on the top is apparently a collar, and in the middle a pin has been peened... I've got to look at mine a little closer. If the hemisphere in the head is larger than the hole in the shaft, I should be able to just hammer in a hot piece of steel and have it mushroom in the recess and be virtually impossible to remove. If it's not.... Maybe I can make it be....

Offline Twilight Fenrir

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Re: Stop.... It's hammer time: New power hammer!
« Reply #31 on: August 09, 2016, 06:19:51 PM »
Well the hammer is now (mostly) complete! :D All the bits are back on the machine, and it turns over by hand very nicely! I'm still shy a pair of dies, but Lazyassforge was kind enough to donate a set to me, so they are on their way through the mail now! I expect they'll be installed before the weekend.

There are still a few adjustments to be made, I need to bend the foot pedal down to a reasonable angle for starters, and of course I still need to figure out how I want to hook a motor up to it. I have some ideas in my head, but progress is probably going to stall here for a little bit while I experiment, and look for parts.

I'm thinking of using a serpentine belt from a car to drive it, or just buying a bit of old flat belt on eBay with some lacing, but then I'll need to find a pulley as well... I also want to do some research into this system: http://www.gates.com/products/industrial/industrial-belts/synchronous-belts/synchro-power-polyurethane-belts

I have a big 1-1/2HP motor that looks awesome laying around, but I'm a little afraid of using it as the basis, because I'm not sure how it's wired... It's setup for either 110, or 220 volt depending on how the 4 wires that come out of it are spliced together. But I have no chart to tell me what's what, and the wires are all black fabric, so I don't know if it's setup for 110 or 220 at the moment... I can power either, I just need to figure out WHICH it is!

Also, a brief PSA:
Springs are devious creatures. DO NOT let your guard down when using clamps to compress a spring :P This is common sense to seasoned mechanics, but even they can become overconfident... I nearly lost the tip of my index finger putting my pitman arms back together...





Offline turnnut

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Re: Stop.... It's hammer time: New power hammer!
« Reply #32 on: August 09, 2016, 06:44:36 PM »
Twilight,  I have been following your interesting resurrection/restoration project,  I was glad to hear you say that you stop
 the progress to think out your next move.

 we all know what happens when we go all out to finish something, then have to waste more time to correct minor ? mistakes.

 that spring must have stung ya,  looks like a nasty blister,  when something like that happens, we tend to hesitate to look
 to see how much damage we did to our self.

 looking at the trip pedal, could you flip it over ??  it looks like it goes upwards, but if it can be flipped, would it be too low.

 keep up the good work, I will stay tuned in on this project.

 hope your finger feels better soon, Frank

Offline Twilight Fenrir

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Re: Stop.... It's hammer time: New power hammer!
« Reply #33 on: August 09, 2016, 07:12:20 PM »
Twilight,  I have been following your interesting resurrection/restoration project,  I was glad to hear you say that you stop
 the progress to think out your next move.

 we all know what happens when we go all out to finish something, then have to waste more time to correct minor ? mistakes.

 that spring must have stung ya,  looks like a nasty blister,  when something like that happens, we tend to hesitate to look
 to see how much damage we did to our self.

 looking at the trip pedal, could you flip it over ??  it looks like it goes upwards, but if it can be flipped, would it be too low.

 keep up the good work, I will stay tuned in on this project.

 hope your finger feels better soon, Frank

Haha, I tend to have an opposite problem... Once I pause something, I have a bad habit of never getting back to it :P My life is full of 90% complete projects, haha, but this one WILL get done!

I just have to take my cutting torch to the pedal and bend it down, there's no two ways about it. It's not the original pedal, but it is a very well crafted, hand made reproduction, my hats off to the original maker. The original would have had a little secondary bar that stuck out of the front of the hoop, and stepped down a bit further as well. With what I've got in my head for the bed I'm going to make for it, I'm also probably going to be making a slightly different, but similar idea extension bar for ease/comfort, which I intend to attach to the existing bar.

I'll have to sit down and make some sketches in the next day or two, and maybe share them to get some input.

Offline Twilight Fenrir

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Re: Stop.... It's hammer time: New power hammer!
« Reply #34 on: August 10, 2016, 06:07:36 AM »
I want to power my hammer, and drill press, like this! :D

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=L0Q6VBw8ClU

Offline Twilight Fenrir

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Re: Stop.... It's hammer time: New power hammer!
« Reply #35 on: August 10, 2016, 08:15:57 AM »
Okay, so here's a rough sketch of what I've got in mind... (not to scale)  I plan on laying five 4x4s, 5ft long next to eachother and running 5/8" threaded rod through every foot, or maybe every 8"... Cutting the front to hug closer to the rounded nose of my machine.

I'm thinking of making a short "U"  shape out of 1" iron pipe, and attaching a 1/4 or 5/16 plate of steel at one end with a bunch of U bolts, or maybe a larger diameter pipe, to work as a pivot. The weight of thd motor serving for tension adjustment. Still looking into what to use for a belt, I'd really like a flat belt, and found where I can get a custom flat belt reasonably on eBay, but the motor pulley is still elusive.

The thing I'm not sure about is, I want to put anchor points at the 4 corners so I can run chains up and pick the thing up with my 2 ton engine hoist. I haven't figured out what kind of anchor to use, how to mount it, or even if it would stay together if I did so.... I THINK the 5/8 rod would hold everything together... Any thoughts?


Offline oldgoaly

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Re: Stop.... It's hammer time: New power hammer!
« Reply #36 on: August 10, 2016, 12:17:47 PM »
I think I would put 3/4" plywood on the top and bottom to hold the 4 by 4 together, using deck screws.
 would be nice if 1 sheet could do both sides. construction grade should be fine.

I've been monitoring this site to see when you fire that hammer up!
http://earthquake.usgs.gov/
<grin>
A bunch of pics (4200+) of tools and project in our shoppe
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Offline Twilight Fenrir

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Re: Stop.... It's hammer time: New power hammer!
« Reply #37 on: August 10, 2016, 06:03:55 PM »
I think I would put 3/4" plywood on the top and bottom to hold the 4 by 4 together, using deck screws.
 would be nice if 1 sheet could do both sides. construction grade should be fine.

I've been monitoring this site to see when you fire that hammer up!
http://earthquake.usgs.gov/
<grin>
That is a VERY good idea, I'm gonna seriously consider doing that. And, yes, one sheet would do both sides :D

Offline turnnut

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Re: Stop.... It's hammer time: New power hammer!
« Reply #38 on: August 11, 2016, 07:45:13 PM »
 Twilight,  what size motor pulley are you looking for ?  if you go with the flat belt.

  O.D.
  width
  shaft I.D.

  also, on the lifting points,  why not cut grooves completely from left to right deep enough to insert u-channel and drill
  from top thru channel for heavy duty long eye bolts.  the nuts and washers would be in the channel.

 just my 2 cent suggestion,  Frank

 

Offline Twilight Fenrir

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Re: Stop.... It's hammer time: New power hammer!
« Reply #39 on: August 11, 2016, 08:16:44 PM »
Twilight,  what size motor pulley are you looking for ?  if you go with the flat belt.

  O.D.
  width
  shaft I.D.

  also, on the lifting points,  why not cut grooves completely from left to right deep enough to insert u-channel and drill
  from top thru channel for heavy duty long eye bolts.  the nuts and washers would be in the channel.

 just my 2 cent suggestion,  Frank
O.D. would be about 2.5"
width I'm not 100% on off the top of my head, I think 1.5-2"
Shaft ID is 3/4"
I'm contemplating welding one up... but if you've got one laying around I'd happily purchase it from you! :D

That's an excellent idea... but, at least on the front, I can't have the eye-bolts come upwards, as they would interfere with the foot pedal. Plus, I don't really have an efficient way to cut such a channel into the 4x4s... That's a really good start of an idea though.... Maybe I could just bore a pair of larger diameter holes through the whole thing alongside the threaded rod holes, slip a piece of schedule 40 or 80 steel electrical conduit into them, and run chain right through the thing... As long as the pipe is pushed through directly under the machine, the holes wouldn't compromise the integrity of the wood while lifting.....
« Last Edit: August 11, 2016, 08:37:24 PM by Twilight Fenrir »

Offline turnnut

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Re: Stop.... It's hammer time: New power hammer!
« Reply #40 on: August 12, 2016, 02:34:40 PM »
message to Twilight;

I just located an olds motor that has been here since ??????????????????????????????????

 (1st brass tag )

 Wagner Electric Mfg.   St. Louis, MO
 QAGNER quality ALTERNATING CURRENT MOTOR
 TYPE 7W6   BA    1 PHASE    1/3 HP   60 CYCLE
 110 V   6.4 AMPS        220 V      3.2 AMPS
 1725 RPM

 (2nd brass tag )
 patented,  there are 8 patent dates on the tag;   Oct. 27, 1903     to   July 29, 1913

 so, it has to be from 1913 or later.

  the pulley;  2 inch O.D
  2 1/8 inch wide
  the I.D. is 5/8 inch,  it has a 3/8" - 16  set screw to lock it on the shaft.

  if you or someone you know has a lathe, it has plenty of material to bore it out to 3/4 inch.

  if you can use this one PM me.   Frank
 
 

Offline Nolatoolguy

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Re: Stop.... It's hammer time: New power hammer!
« Reply #41 on: August 12, 2016, 10:50:50 PM »
I hope this makes sense, let me know if it doesn't.

I would just run threaded rod through the hammer base, top plywood an 4x4 or maybe 6x6(depending how much you notch out) . Then add nuts an washers to both sides. Use some loctite so it doesn't shake loose.

To notch the 4x4 I would just set my saw depth an make passes untill wide enough channel is made.
And I'm proud to be an American,
where at least I know I'm free.
And I won't forget the men who died,
who gave that right to me.
~Lee Greenwood

Offline oldgoaly

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Re: Stop.... It's hammer time: New power hammer!
« Reply #42 on: August 13, 2016, 04:15:42 AM »
If I remember right (this is off the top of my fat head) 25# took 1.5 hp, 50# took 2hp, those are upright PH.
Not sure if the Easy needed less?  I have the L.G. book in my stuff somewhere?
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Offline mikeswrenches

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Re: Stop.... It's hammer time: New power hammer!
« Reply #43 on: August 13, 2016, 04:23:12 AM »
In looking at your motor mounting setup, it might be better to turn it around so that the pivot bracket is mounted toward the frame and the motor hangs toward the rear.  This would make belt installation much easier as well as keeping tension on the belt in use more constant.

I had a wood lathe setup like I described and it worked great.  My two cents worth.
Nice job. I've enjoyed watching all this come together.

Mike

Offline Twilight Fenrir

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Re: Stop.... It's hammer time: New power hammer!
« Reply #44 on: August 13, 2016, 03:48:29 PM »
Well, I picked up the materials to make my base today! I'm gonna go with the 4x4s sandwiched between 3/4" plywood sheets. Threaded rod, and the pipe running through it to pass chains through. I'll either start on it after I eat dinner here, or tomorrow... I don't expect it to take more than a couple hours, but these simple tasks usually manage to surprise me...

Also, my dies, generously donated by Lazyassforge arrived today! The lower die will fit nicely once I make a shim for it... the upper is too large.... However, better too large than too small, it's much easier to grind it to fit than to try to weld it to fit! :P

message to Twilight;

I just located an olds motor that has been here since ??????????????????????????????????

  the pulley;  2 inch O.D
  2 1/8 inch wide
  the I.D. is 5/8 inch,  it has a 3/8" - 16  set screw to lock it on the shaft.

  if you or someone you know has a lathe, it has plenty of material to bore it out to 3/4 inch.

  if you can use this one PM me.   Frank

Hmm, well, less than 2-1/4" will drop me below the hammers "optimal" speed of 325RPM. I believe there's room for adjustment, however, so quite possibly. For now, I have a scheme to try to make one that would be exactly the right size, which I'll fiddle with tomorrow. If that falls through, I'll come looking for yours!

If I remember right (this is off the top of my fat head) 25# took 1.5 hp, 50# took 2hp, those are upright PH.
Not sure if the Easy needed less?  I have the L.G. book in my stuff somewhere?
If /I/ remember right, the 25# calls for a 3/4hp motor... but, again, this is off the top of my head as well :P

Well, I looked it up, and the 25# wants a 1HP, the 50# wants 2HP. So the 35lb Easy Helve should be right in the middle, right?!? Haha, no, I'm sure it doesn't work that way... That being said, I'm honestly not sure what kind of difference the HP of the motor really makes... The smith I learned from ran his 50# hammer with a 1/2HP motor, seemingly just fine o.o He's been using it that way for over a decade!

In looking at your motor mounting setup, it might be better to turn it around so that the pivot bracket is mounted toward the frame and the motor hangs toward the rear.  This would make belt installation much easier as well as keeping tension on the belt in use more constant.

I had a wood lathe setup like I described and it worked great.  My two cents worth.
Nice job. I've enjoyed watching all this come together.

Mike
It may very well be better the other way around, I turned it that way to try to save a little bit of space. The "foot" of the hammer sticks out past the body, so if I put it on MY way, I could snug the motor up a little closer to the frame, and shorten the overall footprint... But I'll fiddle with it a bit and see, I have a waist-belt I can slip on to turn by hand and get an approximate feel for it. Thanks for the input!