Author Topic: My "new" 25" camelback drill press!  (Read 964 times)

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Offline Bill Houghton

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Re: My "new" 25" camelback drill press!
« Reply #15 on: May 18, 2017, 02:18:15 PM »
geezers that really use those drill press call 'em "upright" floor drill press and get a little !@#$%^&*())(*&^%$#@! when called camelbacks.  ask me how i know………   nice machine.
Gee, how do you know?  And did your learning leave any physical scars, or just emotional?

Maybe the geezers in question thought you were referring to them when you said "camelback"   :smiley:

Online Twilight Fenrir

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Re: My "new" 25" camelback drill press!
« Reply #16 on: May 18, 2017, 06:31:01 PM »
Well, made some interesting progress today... Figured out my belt size, 3" x 184". I'll start hunting down a source for that.

Also discovered that I bought a chuck, and got a free drillpress thrown in... because I have a Jacob's No. 36 in there. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Jacobs-drill-chuck-no-36-3-16-3-4-capacity-/252676429796?hash=item3ad4b057e4:g:83oAAOSwcUBYTDpf

Haha, I ordered a key for it.

I discovered ANOTHER gear reducer built into the top belt drum! A little armature goes up and secures a post that holds a plate on the pulley. There's a planetary gearset inside of it, and it seems to slow it down something like 4 to 1. But I'm not sure yet, as I can't quite get a full rotation out of it right now, the whole drum is full of nut shells from a squirrel, and it's been heck trying to clean it out... The previous owner installed a plate over the post, and had disabled the locking arm, so it's possible the gears inside are broken, Otherwise disabling it seems silly... Either way, I'll find out eventually.



The motor took a turn down confusing avenue... I opened up what I thought would be a simple switch and found a fairly complex motor control system... I'm not sure what I'm looking at, and thus far, google hasn't been helping me as much as I'd like... Still working on it... There's a wiring and instruction diagram inside the case, but it's so old and covered with oil it's very difficult to read. But it seems the possibility of it being polyphasic is back on the table, as at least one of the diagrams seems to indicate 3 wires could be used for 2 phase, or 3 phase....



« Last Edit: May 18, 2017, 06:33:11 PM by Twilight Fenrir »

Online Twilight Fenrir

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Re: My "new" 25" camelback drill press!
« Reply #17 on: May 18, 2017, 06:39:45 PM »
Ah crap... it's a 3 phase... another motor I can't use... I wish the 3phase converters weren't so expensive. It might be worth my time to pick one up when I've got some extra money laying around... which never happens... because I throw it all at old tools >_>   <_<

Offline oldgoaly

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Re: My "new" 25" camelback drill press!
« Reply #18 on: May 18, 2017, 07:52:50 PM »
make one!
http://www.metalwebnews.com/electric.html

I've made two and have not had one problem with them, the static one I bought lasted a month or two past the warranty. waste of money! 1st pic one I built to run my bridgeport, pic 2 is the insides of the static that blew.
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Online Twilight Fenrir

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Re: My "new" 25" camelback drill press!
« Reply #19 on: May 19, 2017, 05:06:07 AM »
make one!
http://www.metalwebnews.com/electric.html

I've made two and have not had one problem with them, the static one I bought lasted a month or two past the warranty. waste of money! 1st pic one I built to run my bridgeport, pic 2 is the insides of the static that blew.
That's flipping awesome! Unfortunately, the biggest 3ph I have at the moment is the one on my drill press, (assuming, anyway, based on its physical size) but I know I could pick up a 3-4hp 3ph motor easily and cheaply enough to make this practical.

I'll probably strip off the motor and switch for the  time being, and replace them with the half horse I have on my other large press for the time being, but I'll hang onto the 3ph gear for future conversion.

Thanks! :D

Offline wrenchguy

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Re: My "new" 25" camelback drill press!
« Reply #20 on: May 19, 2017, 05:15:16 AM »
geezers that really use those drill press call 'em "upright" floor drill press and get a little !@#$%^&*())(*&^%$#@! when called camelbacks.  ask me how i know………   nice machine.
Gee, how do you know?  And did your learning leave any physical scars, or just emotional?

Maybe the geezers in question thought you were referring to them when you said "camelback"   :smiley:

just emotional… 30 years ago i bought 1 at a sale and the auctioneer called it camelback. shortly after went to steam show where smithys were setup working and using a upright.  1st mistake then, listening to auctioneer, then 3 years back another auctioneer said he thought this was a flame thrower.  i knowed better this time.  i guess i should thank auctioneers for a round bout education.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xCkjPxe_gVg&t
« Last Edit: May 19, 2017, 05:26:49 AM by wrenchguy »
Hmmmmmm.......

Offline oldgoaly

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Re: My "new" 25" camelback drill press!
« Reply #21 on: May 19, 2017, 05:17:29 AM »
If you know a hvac contractor you could get some used run capacitors for free. they last!
The 3hp ran a couple of years then I had to have a bigger one so asked a friend to look for one he had a 5 hp crocker-wheeler motor that was stuck, but a good cleaning, little sand paper, new grease in bearings it's been going since 1995. I greased it in 2015 for the second time.
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Online Twilight Fenrir

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Re: My "new" 25" camelback drill press!
« Reply #22 on: May 19, 2017, 06:08:22 AM »
Ooh, this could make for a nice idler :D

https://duluth.craigslist.org/hvo/6077169234.html

Contacted the seller about it, I'll see where it goes... I'd probably start with the manual switch for the time being, just for expediency. Can always rig up the auto-start at a future date. It'd be sweet to be able to use the motor that came with the press :D

I've always heard these presses called camelbacks by oldtimers.... Any drill press that's not a benchtop is an upright, by my understanding of the taxonomy o.o
« Last Edit: May 19, 2017, 06:10:38 AM by Twilight Fenrir »

Online Twilight Fenrir

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Re: My "new" 25" camelback drill press!
« Reply #23 on: May 19, 2017, 09:25:34 AM »
Any idea what kind of amperage the idler motor will draw? Is it going to be equal to plate values?

If I'm running that 3HP motor, that's 10amps on 3ph, since its only running on 2 phase, is it going to be pulling 15 amps per line, 10 amps, or 6.6 amps? I need to add whatever the idler consumes to what I'm going to run to figure out what kind of wiring I need to run...

Offline oldgoaly

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Re: My "new" 25" camelback drill press!
« Reply #24 on: May 19, 2017, 12:30:07 PM »
Start up amps is lock rotor "lra" but that is only for a less than a second, wire size and amp draw use the "FLA" full load amps. The idler motor doesn't draw that cause there is no load till you start the drill press motor  then you will draw that amperage plus a little more for the idler. I had the sme questions when I made my 1st and once I got it going I had the amprobe and volt meter to see what it really was doing. Well my memory isn't that good 93 and 95, hell that was last century!  I run the imbalanced  which has not hurt any motor so far! The Jim Hanrahan version I think it still is among the list, list is bigger now!
You will need to have the slow blow fuses or the harc style breaker for you motor.
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Online Twilight Fenrir

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Re: My "new" 25" camelback drill press!
« Reply #25 on: May 19, 2017, 07:29:00 PM »
Start up amps is lock rotor "lra" but that is only for a less than a second, wire size and amp draw use the "FLA" full load amps. The idler motor doesn't draw that cause there is no load till you start the drill press motor  then you will draw that amperage plus a little more for the idler. I had the sme questions when I made my 1st and once I got it going I had the amprobe and volt meter to see what it really was doing. Well my memory isn't that good 93 and 95, hell that was last century!  I run the imbalanced  which has not hurt any motor so far! The Jim Hanrahan version I think it still is among the list, list is bigger now!
You will need to have the slow blow fuses or the harc style breaker for you motor.

Makes sense... I'm gonna run #10 wire, just to be safe, though. Plus, that will build up a nice comfortable buffer if I ever start wanting to run just ridiculous motors :P Tomorrow I'm going to pick up that 3HP 3ph motor to use as my idler. Which should let me run anything I'll need in the forseeable future. I estimate my home-made 3phase converter will cost me about $130 when all is said and done. Heck of a lot cheaper than a production one.

I also ordered a flat belt from McMaster Carr.

Also good news, I got the gear reducer built into the drum turning! :D It's a little sticky every now and then, but I'm gonna start hosing it down with PB buster daily and giving it a few turns to try and smooth it out. It has a 5 to 1 ratio when engaged.... Between the initial V-belt step down, the flat belt step downs, and the gear reducer, I think I'll be able to slow the drill down to less than 60 RPMs o_o Guess I'll be good if I ever need to drill 2" holes in a block of steel with a twist drill bit, lol.

I still have no idea what that detent pull-out post with the perforated wheel behind it is for... The perforated wheel turns with the drill, and the post rides along a shaft inside when adjusted...

Also, the flat belt pulleys are obviously meant for speed adjustment, moving the belt from one step to another just like modern presses... But I don't see any way to slacken the belt so it can be moved... I had to cut the old one off. Does anyone have any insight on this? I wonder if it has to do with that missing bar/arm directly above the lower drum... EDIT: Okay, found my answer on adjusting the belt: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XFJVmahx4vg

Thanks!
« Last Edit: May 19, 2017, 08:22:31 PM by Twilight Fenrir »

Online Twilight Fenrir

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Re: My "new" 25" camelback drill press!
« Reply #26 on: May 22, 2017, 07:02:40 PM »
Progress steams right along...

I really love the lines on this press... It looks like how H.R. Geiger would design a drill press. (I'm mostly looking at the curved part that comes up over the top on that one, it very much resembles a Xenomorph from Alien) I really want to sit and paint the thing... but that's time and expense I don't have right now.


I managed to move the thing across my shop by lifting it on top of some lengths of 3/8" round stock, and just pushing it. This would be much easier if my garage floor were smooth, but unfortunately my uncle didn't take the time to do a nice job when he put it in 30 years ago... oh well, at least it isn't cracked...



As it turns out, McMaster Car is also from Minnesota, so my belt showed up this morning after only one business day... I had a little trouble installing the alligator, the back side kept wanting to twist rather than to dig into the belt. But after some fiddling with a pair of needle nose pliers, and using my blacksmith vise instead of a hammer, I got the lacing in and the belt on. (Yes, my shop is a horrible nightmare of a mess... it's constantly changing and evolving... I'm working on organizing it ^^;)



I drilled, and tapped the broken handle. Inserting a 1/4" machine screw, and JB ClearWelded the two parts back together, as well as the screw. Supposedly the Clearweld has a 4,400PSI yield strength, (Which is 500 greater than regular JB) combined with the screw, I'm hoping this will make for a sufficient repair.



As it turns out... my friend has a similar-era W.F.&J. Barne's drill press laying in his yard, though this one has the moveable head. Unfortunately, he is unwilling to sell me parts for mine... but his does have some stickers which shed light on the funny perforated wheel with the adjustable post. This adjusts the feed-speed of the auto-feed.




I'm just waiting on the capacitor for my new 3HP 3ph motor to build my 3 phase converter, and some new v-belts to link the motor to the flat belts. Both of which should be here before the end of the week, so I should have her up and running this weekend at the latest, assuming both motors work! Though, I have a known good 3/4HP 3ph already I'll swap out with the included motor if it doesn't run.

Offline p_toad

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Re: My "new" 25" camelback drill press!
« Reply #27 on: May 23, 2017, 05:23:55 PM »
Nice.   Looks like a sweetie.   Too bad about that other one rusting in the yard..   :tongue:

Online Twilight Fenrir

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Re: My "new" 25" camelback drill press!
« Reply #28 on: May 25, 2017, 03:45:29 PM »
YUS! My 3 phase converter works like a charm! And the motor that came with my drill press works too! :D

Just have to take apart my bench-test, and run the wires through my garage and I'll have 3 phase power in my shop! Thank you so much for suggesting this idea, oldgoaly, this is gonna make life much easier in the long haul... and much cheaper to pick up motors for my heavy machinery, as no one can actually use 3 phase :P

For some reason, my V belts haven't shipped out yet... which is annoying... Otherwise, I'm all good to go!

Offline oldgoaly

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Re: My "new" 25" camelback drill press!
« Reply #29 on: May 25, 2017, 06:05:33 PM »
yes it is that easy!  glad you made one!

A bunch of pics (3000+) of tools and project in our shoppe
https://www.facebook.com/187845251266156/photos/?tab=albums