Author Topic: Hand Planes  (Read 141558 times)

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Online coolford

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #990 on: August 02, 2019, 01:52:35 PM »
Instead of your high dollar planes lets looks at one made for a specific job.  This Masonite Products plane was made to smooth the cut edges after cutting.  If you ever cut Masonite with a saw you know what a messy edge resulted.  This little plane was made for Masonite by the Kimball MFG. Co of Evanston , ILL.  and says Pat. Pend.  The cutter has two positions, a left and a right and requires taking the screw out and moving it either left or right.  Also the cutter is adjustable by loosening the screw and moving it up and down in the slot to make a shallow or deeper cut.  This little odd ball was in my lot of 21 planes for $7.50.

Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #991 on: August 05, 2019, 02:24:46 PM »
Hi coolford,

That is one really unique little plane, and in my opinion, because of its uniqueness, probably the “sleeper” in the bunch.  I’ve never seen that one, so I really appreciate the photos!  Believe it or not, Stanley being Stanley and trying to fill EVERY conceivable niche, including planing Masonite (or hardboard), produced a “hardboard” plane between 1937 and 1943.  It was specifically made to clean up the edges of Masonite/hardboard.  Stanley’s version was the #195.  Unfortunately I don’t have one to show you.  It’s a fairly scarce tool to say the least and I’ve only seen them on a small handful of occasions.  Good ones in nice condition can sell for several hundred dollars.  I’ll add one to my collection eventually.  Anyway, thanks for the pictures!  That’s a nice little find for sure!

Jim C.
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Offline lptools

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #992 on: August 05, 2019, 03:51:37 PM »
Hello, Coolford. That is a neat little plane!!  Regards, Lou
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Offline Bill Houghton

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #993 on: August 05, 2019, 03:53:32 PM »
...Stanley being Stanley and trying to fill EVERY conceivable niche, including planing Masonite (or hardboard), produced a “hardboard” plane between 1937 and 1943.  It was specifically made to clean up the edges of Masonite/hardboard.  Stanley’s version was the #195.
Back then, fiberboard was the Newest Best Thing, and was offered in grades of hardness.  Stanley's fiberboard planes came in versions that could plane the different grades.  My bride and I used to stay in some cabins south of Crater Lake, built by two brothers in the 1930s, on which the top half of the walls were done in fiberboard of the moderately hard grade.  It's different from masonite, more nearly resembling particleboard but subtly different.  The walls show evidence that the brothers may have had someone's fiberboard planes, as they have V-grooves both at the joints of the panels (like plywood, sheetrock, etc., fiberboard came in panels for quick, efficient application to the wall) and periodically across the face of the panels for decorative purposes.  I'm fairly confident that the V-grooves in the fields of the panels were applied at installation, as they were somewhat irregularly spaced.

Record, of England, also offered fiberboard planes; they're discussed in the book "Planecraft," which is partly a paean to Record tools, which is where most of my knowledge comes from.

Even the bathroom was done in fiberboard, with generous applications of paint to waterproof it.  It was in surprisingly good shape.

What seemed crazy by modern standards is that the bottom half of the walls was done in beautifully detailed vertical wood tongue-and-groove or shiplap, from lumber growing on the property (we were told), which would nowadays be considered rustic and lovely.  The cabins were furnished with beds, tables, etc., all made by the brothers and still in great shape; and the windows (sliding barn sash) could be opened and shut with one finger.  So the brothers knew their stuff.

We miss that place (last time we were up there, it was closed).  When we stayed there, the granddaughter (I think it was) of one of the original builders and her husband were operating it, and they told us some of the history.  One brother and his sister-in-law died, and the remaining brother and sister-in-law kept operating the cabins into the postwar period.  As they got older and slowed down, if the sister-in-law hadn't gotten around to doing the laundry and had no clean sheets for the cabins, they would just say they had no vacancies.

Even though we have an RV now, and will probably stay in that on our next trip to Crater Lake (we need to get up there again soon...one of America's natural cathedrals), I'd be willing to park it and stay in the cabins just to soak in the experience.  So sad that they closed.

Also in that part of the state is the Grand Lodge at the Oregon Caves, the last National Park Grand Lodge built.  Since it was built during the Depression, it was built to a budget, and, when we toured it on our first visit some years back, the rooms were paneled in a somewhat softer fiberboard that had sagged between the nails holding panels to the walls.  "Dingy" is a polite description (actually, the rooms in the Grand Lodges are often not very impressive; the lobbies are where the architects focused their attention).  Last we were up there, earlier this year, the Chateau was closed for renovations.  The description of the chateau on their website (http://www.oregoncaveschateau.com/Page.asp?NavID=20) specifically mentions the fiberboard, so it will be interesting to see if they replicate it.

Drywall drove fiberboard out of the market, for the most part, because it could be finished to resemble plaster, although homasote, one of the softer fiberboards, is still offered, mainly (at least in the residential building market) as a sound reducer.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2019, 03:55:28 PM by Bill Houghton »

Offline lptools

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #994 on: August 05, 2019, 04:10:52 PM »
Hello, Jim.  There were a few planes in that series, starting with the 193, which was a Cutter Plane that had attachments for beveling, grooves, ship-lap, etc,. (sort of like the 45 of fiber board bevelers). I believe the 195 was a dedicated Fiber Board Beveler. These were used on Celotex which I believe is now referred to by the product name Homasote, Beaverboard ( black in color, nasty to work with, it is the sheathing on my 1954 built home), and Masonite. These products all went by the wayside with the introduction of plywood, and OSB. There was also a 193A, 193B, and a 194. Stanley felt the need for these specialty planes, but I don't think they worked well. What I don't know is; how common are they? Did Stanley cease production quickly on these?. Just my 2 cents, Lou
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Offline lptools

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #995 on: August 05, 2019, 04:15:14 PM »
Hello, Bill. Looks like we were typing at the same time, although I am much slower!!! Regards, Lou
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Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #996 on: August 05, 2019, 06:48:14 PM »
Hey Bill and Lou,

GREAT comments!  Bill, I really enjoyed reading your recollections of days gone by.  Thanks for taking the time add some good stuff to the thread.  You wouldn’t happen to have a photo or two of those cabins would you?  Lou, also thanks for bringing a few other related Stanley planes into the conversation.  I have zero experience with any of them, however, I do occasionally use Masonite to make electric router jigs/cutting guides.  Talking about these planes now makes me want one to try out.  Oh boy........ I might have to start hunting for one.

Jim C.
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Offline p_toad

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #997 on: August 13, 2019, 06:16:38 PM »
Had a strange beasty come into the Restore today - a Stanley 139.   Two blades but no accessories.   Sorry i didn't get pictures but will try Thursday if I can.   Also had a Stanley Bailey groovy number 7. :smiley:

Offline Bill Houghton

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #998 on: August 13, 2019, 07:40:46 PM »
Had a strange beasty come into the Restore today - a Stanley 139.   Two blades but no accessories.
Stanley 139?  I didn't realize there was such a tool - is it a plane?  It's not listed in Patrick Leach's website on the Stanley planes.  There's a 239, which looks kind of like this 238 (picture courtesy of Patrick Leach's website):

Is that what you've got?  And, when you say, no accessories, do you mean, no fence?  In its early days, the 239 apparently had no fence.

I'm tempted to ask what your price is...but, no, no, I don't need it...must resist.

Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #999 on: August 14, 2019, 05:44:30 AM »
If anyone is looking for a little more information and photos, we covered the #238 back on page 34, reply 506, and discussed it again on page 41, reply 603, while covering the #248.  The #239 was covered back on page 58, replies 858 and 859.  Peter, take a few photos and show us what you have.

Jim C.
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Offline p_toad

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1000 on: August 14, 2019, 03:32:13 PM »
My bad...   I meant 193 (don't know my numbers yet).   There are a few listed on fleabay.

Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1001 on: August 15, 2019, 02:40:02 PM »
I recently started working on a project I started several months ago, but had to put on the back burner for a while.  Just before I stopped the process, I had chopped out some mortises in the legs and cut tenons on the ends of the stretchers.  For what ever reason, when I’m making joints, I tend to cut one or sometimes both mating parts a little big.  I don’t necessarily do that on purpose, but it seems to happen almost always.  It must be sub conscious because I do it a lot without really thinking about it.  The result is a joint that’s too snug for glue, or just won’t go together.  In order to make the parts fit correctly, I need to “sneak up” on the final fit by making little adjustments using a chisel, plane, sandpaper, or combination of tools.  A block plane is typically in the mix.  Stanley and other manufacturers made planes specifically for purposes of fine tuning furniture joints.  You might be thinking, “Oh, Jim’s gonna feature a special purpose block plane.”  Well, you’re sort of correct.  There’s a block plane involved, but I want to show you a simple jig that helps in the planing process.

One of my favorite joints is the mortise and tenon.  It’s tried and true and I use it frequently in furniture construction.   Going back to what I was saying above, I seem to ALWAYS cut the tenons too wide for the mortises.  Now maybe I’m wrong about this, but in my opinion, it’s a lot easier to adjust the tenons to fit the mortises than the other way around.  A special block plane with rabbet sides, like the Sargent #507 covered back on page 11, reply 162, is such a plane.  If you already checked out the photos below, you probably noticed that Lie-Nielsen also makes a version of the plane.  I’m sure others do too.  Anyway, both are perfect for taking fine shaving from the cheeks of tenons that are a little too thick for the mortises they’re supposed to fit into.   So what I really want you to focus on is the simple jig underneath the work piece.  It’s called a bench hook, I guess for obvious reasons.  The cleat on the bottom of the jig “hooks” to the edge of the workbench, while the cleat on top provides a solid, stable surface to push against while advancing a plane across the grain of a rock hard maple tenon.  Now, the bench hook is not a crutch for a dull, or just sort of sharp cutting iron.  Your plane iron needs to be sharp!!  With a sharp iron set for a light pass, and a solid bench hook, adjusting the tenon cheeks is a breeze.  I typically make a pass and then test the fit in the mortise.  If it’s too tight, I flip the work piece over and make another light pass on the opposite cheek.  That keeps the tenon centered on the end of the stretcher.  Test the fit again.  In the case of my particular project, two passes on both cheeks did the trick and the joint fit perfectly. 

In an effort to make the adjustments to the tenon using a bench hook, the jig itself must be solid.  I like to make the bottom cleat substantial.  It should be wide enough to accept several drywall screws without splitting and deeper than the edge of my workbench so it doesn’t pop off the edge of the bench while in use.  Can you imagine the bench hook “letting go” or failing somehow while you were pushing the plane forward and pressing the workpiece into the top cleat?  That would be bad for your project and worse for your knuckles, hands, etc.  Both cleats should be glued and screwed to the base.  The screws need to be countersunk to prevent hand injuries.  I guess the bottom line is to take pride in your jigs and make them user friendly.  They should be as important as the project you’re working on, and made just as well.   Take your time making them and they’ll serve you for years to come.

Finally, I think I know my audience here, but I’m not always sure.  I hope I didn't insult anyone's woodworking intelligence.  I know this was a simple presentation relating to a very basic jig.  I know many of you are familiar with bench hooks and probably use them without ever thinking twice about it.  But, there may be a new woodworker/hand plane enthusiast who just discovered an unknown technique and now has the confidence to take that next step.

Jim C.         
« Last Edit: August 15, 2019, 05:22:34 PM by Jim C. »
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Offline Bill Houghton

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1002 on: August 15, 2019, 04:15:39 PM »
I still have the small bench hook I made probably 40 years ago.  I used dowels rather than screws, and it's held up.

Offline lptools

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1003 on: August 15, 2019, 04:26:13 PM »
Hello, Bill. Bench hooks are indeed a simple, but very useful fixture  to woodworking!!  I like the idea of the dowels, to prevent damage to the edge tools???? Jim, we do a lot of mortise/tenon joinery at work, although with a horizontal mortiser and table saw. The final fit still comes down to tweaking the tenon to the mortise. Regards, Lou
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Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1004 on: August 15, 2019, 05:17:38 PM »
........ The final fit still comes down to tweaking the tenon to the mortise. Regards, Lou

No doubt Lou. Adjusting the tenon is a lot easier than trying to fix the mortise.  A good bench hook and a rabbet plane with a sharp iron are essential.

Jim C.
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