Author Topic: Hand Planes  (Read 155863 times)

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Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1080 on: November 17, 2019, 02:53:15 PM »
And, it's not even required to collect them; I see myself as more of a gatherer with a plan to use the planes - although I find my gathering outstrips my using, I'm still oriented toward functional planes.

But it all works.

Amen to that Bill!  Right on point.  It all works.

Jim C.

« Last Edit: November 17, 2019, 05:24:34 PM by Jim C. »
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Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1081 on: November 27, 2019, 06:59:43 PM »
I hope everyone has a very happy Thanksgiving with family and friends!

Jim C.
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Offline p_toad

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1082 on: November 27, 2019, 10:10:21 PM »
Right back at you.   Hope all have a safe and happy Thanksgiving. 

Online lptools

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1083 on: November 28, 2019, 05:35:55 AM »
Hello Jim. Happy Thanksgiving to everyone!!! Regards, Lou
Member of PHARTS-  Perfect Handle Admiration, Restoration and Torturing Society

Online Papaw

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1084 on: November 28, 2019, 08:26:17 AM »
I hope all who observe Thanksgiving enjoy the day .
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Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1085 on: December 01, 2019, 07:11:58 PM »
Well, it’s Sunday night and the end of what was a pretty good holiday weekend.  I went to visit my parents for Thanksgiving and in the process totally over indulged myself and have zero regrets for doing so!  I hope you all enjoyed a great Thanksgiving as well.  Anyway, I’m sure no one wants to read about my over eating.  So where is this going?  About a week or so before Thanksgiving I was talking to my mom and she happened to mentioned that she and my dad recently visited an old family friend who had given my dad a garage sale found hand plane.  She said I could pick the plane up when I came by for Thanksgiving.  Not that I needed any more incentive to go enjoy a perfect turkey dinner with my family, but an old hand plane made the anticipation all the better!

On more than one occasion throughout the thread, you’ve heard me say that people have given my dad old planes to donate to my collection.  He doesn’t really know anything about them, and neither does my mom.  He just takes the planes, thanks the donor, and passes them along to me.  The process always interests me because I don’t know what I’m getting until I actually see the plane.  I typically ask questions, get the best answers my dad can muster, and generally get some idea of the plane’s condition, manufacturer, size, etc.  Since I was talking to my mom, I went through the same quiz with her.  In the end, all she could really tell me was that the plane seemed to be in okay condition and that it was manufactured in the U.S.A.  I just figured I’d see it in a week and go from there.  And that’s what happened. 

Shortly after I arrived at my parents’ house, I asked my mom about that plane.  We went into the spare bedroom and there it was sitting on her computer desk.  I could immediately tell that it was not an old Stanley.  I’m not gonna lie, I’m always hoping for a Stanley.  Not this time.  Still, at first glance, it seemed to be in reasonable condition, undamaged, and all the parts were present and accounted for.  There was a little crud and light surface rust here and there, but generally speaking, the plane was at least worth a little more attention.  My next thought was to determine who manufactured the plane.  Nothing on the main casting other than “MADE IN U.S.A.” right behind the front knob, and again “MADE IN U.S.A.” at the top of the cutting iron.  That was it!  I checked the external cheeks on the main casting, removed the lever cap and closely inspected the chip breaker and underside of the iron, and behind the frog on the main casting.  Basically, I looked at all the spots on a bench plane where one might find the manufacturer’s name or logo.  I found nothing.  So, my mom did give me accurate answers to my questions.

Once I got home I cleaned the plane up and spent some time scouring my hand plane reference materials and the internet in an effort to determine who might have manufactured it.  So far, I’m leaning toward it possibly being a Shelton, or on an outside chance, perhaps a Millers Falls plane.  Looking at its physical features, the first thing I noticed when I removed the lever cap and chip breaker/iron assembly is that the plane does not have a lateral adjustment lever, and its frog is a static part of the main body casting.  While there is a knurled cutting iron advancement/retraction screw that operates a yoke and inserts into the chip breaker, much like many other bench planes produced by several manufacturers to include Stanley, the entire assembly sort of reminds me of what one might see on a block plane.  The lack of a lateral adjustment lever and the “block plane-like” frog lead me to think that the plane was designed and marketed as an economical choice for casual hand plane users.  The knob and tote are made from a hard wood and stained an orange/red color.  They alone make me think the plane was made by Shelton.  Coupled with some of the plane’s other shortcomings, Shelton might not be a bad guess.  Still for a plane that might be an “economy model,” it does have some substance in terms of weight.  It’s relatively heavy and sports an attractive cast iron stippled lever cap.  The main body casting is 9.25 inches long and 2.125 inches wide.  The iron is 1.75 inches wide.  That’s all I can say about this mystery plane.  Does it look familiar to anyone?  Anyone have any thoughts about who may have manufactured it?  Don’t be afraid to chime in!

Typically, I probably wouldn’t spend too much more time with a plane like this, but for some crazy and unexplainable reason, I want to sharpen the iron and see how it works!  While I may never know who made this plane, I guess there’s no reason to wonder if it can produce a nice shaving.  Maybe I’ll give it a try.

Jim C.           
« Last Edit: December 01, 2019, 08:05:45 PM by Jim C. »
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Online Bill Houghton

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1086 on: December 01, 2019, 08:53:09 PM »
It resembles a Defiance-marked plane I've got (I think I actually have two - can't recall if I gave one away).  If/when I get a chance, I'll try to pull it/them off the high shelf the "not really ever gonna use this, but it's interesting" planes live on, do a comparison, etc.

Offline Northwoods

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1087 on: December 02, 2019, 08:48:17 AM »
The color of the wood says Millers Falls.
But....
The ORIGINAL Northwoods.

Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1088 on: December 02, 2019, 12:55:40 PM »
Bill,

You’re a fountain of hand plane knowledge and 100% correct!  It is a Defiance.  Thanks!

Jim C.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2019, 12:58:37 PM by Jim C. »
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Online coolford

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1089 on: December 02, 2019, 02:09:02 PM »
Jim----Well, you still have your reputation, Defiance made by Stanley.  I have a number of Defiance planes and here are a couple.  The one in front is equal to a #3 and the other to a #4.  In the next picture the one you have appears to be the #3 as shown by the narrow width and yours matches mine as the tote is flat on the side.  Last picture shows the frog as part of the casting which also matches your plane.  I like the frogs on these planes as they are somewhat ornamental.---Charles

Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1090 on: December 02, 2019, 03:15:03 PM »
So now I know what I have thanks to Bill's initial identification and coolford's confirmation!!  You guys are sharp!  I have a Defiance smoother, which was an economy line of tools produced by Stanley.  In an effort to better identify the plane, in terms of model number and production time, I went back to some of my reference materials and did find what I believe is the plane in question.  I found it in Alvin Sellens's book, "The Stanley Plane", first published in 1975.  In reference to Defiance planes, Sellens commented that, "The illustrations and descriptions (in Stanley catalogs and Stanley advertisement materials, etc.) do not indicate any means of identification such as (model) numbers cast or stamped on the parts.  The lack of marking plus the paucity of catalog descriptions make identification of this (Defiance) series practically impossible."  Obviously Mr. Sellens didn't consult with Bill and coolford before he wrote that.  Anyway, I have included pages from Sellens's book that show and describe what I believe is the plane I featured above in reply #1085.  Based on that information, I'd say my plane is a model #1243 and was manufactured between 1940 and 1962.  The only discrepancy I see is that Sellens described the plane as being 8" long, while my plane is a little over 9" long.  I guess it depends on where the measurements are taken from on the plane’s sole. Notice the photo depicts the stippled lever cap as I described above, and Sellens's physical description also mentions the unusual frog configuration.  Based on the totality of things, I'd say, "Mystery solved!" 

Jim C.   
« Last Edit: December 03, 2019, 11:14:19 AM by Jim C. »
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Online coolford

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1091 on: December 02, 2019, 05:07:35 PM »
I forgot to mention, pressed into the wood on the side of the tote of the #3 is "Defiance by Stanley".

Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1092 on: December 02, 2019, 06:19:06 PM »
I forgot to mention, pressed into the wood on the side of the tote of the #3 is "Defiance by Stanley".

That would have helped me tremendously in the identification process if my example of the plane would have had the same thing stamped on its tote.  No such luck, but I got the information in the end, and we got to talk about hand planes.  All good stuff!

Jim C.
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Online Bill Houghton

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1093 on: December 03, 2019, 08:30:48 AM »
I once found - and, oh joy, just found again!* - a good article on the Defiance line of tools: https://www.farmcollector.com/tools/stanley-tool-co-defiance-zm0z12augzbea.

I was struck by how thin the cutting iron is on my examples of the Defiance planes.  You wouldn't want to plane any wood that was in a resistant mood.  I have idly considered turning one of my Defiance planes into a roughing plane, like a scrub but with less radius to the iron; but, if I do, I'll need to adapt some other, thicker plane iron.

And thanks for the compliment, but I would consider myself more of a leaking faucet of knowledge about hand tools.
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*You never know with the internet.  Stuff comes, stuff goes...
« Last Edit: December 03, 2019, 08:32:27 AM by Bill Houghton »

Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #1094 on: December 04, 2019, 08:51:59 AM »
Hey Bill,

Thanks for posting that link regarding Defiance planes.......Again!  I noticed you previously posted it back on page 45, reply 663, almost three years ago.  Many thanks for digging it up again!  It’s always interesting to see how Stanley tried to fill every niche in the market, and the reasoning behind its decision to aim a specific plane at a particular segment of the tool using population.  Why should farmers be excluded?  Anyway, I’m thankful that I’ve kept up the index.  There’s a lot of great content sprinkled throughout the thread.  A few times I’ve gotten mentally lazy and considered letting it slide a little, but my OCD won’t let that happen.

In terms of your tool/plane knowledge, well, I think you’re being modest to say the least.  I can appreciate that.  I’m sure if we went back through all 73 pages of the thread to date, your well written, concise, experience based responses would be evident.  All I can say is thank you for frequently stopping by and adding some outstanding content to the thread!  I really appreciate it.

Jim C.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2019, 09:11:02 AM by Jim C. »
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