Author Topic: Hand Planes  (Read 324515 times)

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Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #270 on: April 18, 2014, 11:30:19 PM »
In the last couple days Lie-Nielsen (LN) hand planes have worked their way into the discussion.  If you were not familiar with them, perhaps the recent conversation prompted you to check them out.  LN has a nice website that features their tools, woodworking events, and several informative You Tube videos regarding the care and use of several of its products.  The LN website is worth checking out.  Just google search Lie-Nielsen and you’re sure to find it.

LN is certainly a higher end tool manufacturer.  I think the actual quality of their products and their prices reflect that.  Are their hand planes worth the cost?  That’s really a matter of ones personal choice.  Do LN planes live up to their hype?  From the experience that I’ve had with a few of them in my own shop, I believe that they do.  Do LN planes out perform their antique counterparts?  I guess that’s a matter for further debate.  Generally speaking, most antique planes are definitely capable of producing very high quality results that are as nice as anything a LN plane can produce, and vise versa, provided the antique is sharp and in good working order.  The same basic criteria applies to the LN plane.  Where I believe that LN planes separate themselves from the antiques is in the higher quality of construction, materials, and attention to the fit and finish.  LN certainly has the advantage in production techniques, and engineering improvements, and it’s obvious that their tools have benefited from decades of experience (some good, some bad) that Stanley and other companies endured in the hand plane production learning curve.  Just pick up a LN hand plane.  Hold it in your hands.  Operate its adjusting mechanisms.  Almost immediately, it’s very easy to see that it’s a high quality tool that was manufactured with precision and care.  There’s just no denying that.

With all that being said, will using an LN plane automatically make you a better craftsperson?  No.  I think we all know that wood working, like any craft that involves shaping raw, natural, and man made materials, requires years of practice, experimentation, and experience.  The use of tools and techniques are refined, revised, and re-evaluated.  The learning never ends.  Using a LN plane, or its “distant Stanley relative” can potentially lead a person to the same end.  Each tool will hopefully bring its user to that certain level of satisfaction that he/she desires.  There’s no shame in using either one.  It really boils down to personal taste, economics, availability of the particular tool, and the experience that an individual wishes to have.  The PERCEPTION that using a certain tool versus another is good or bad, right or wrong, foolish or wise, should never enter the equation.  Use what you like, and don't be afraid to try something different.

Lie-Nielsen #60 ½:

I bought the LN #60 ½ block plane way back in 1999.  At the time, I had a couple old Stanley block planes that worked just fine, but I was at a woodworking demonstration and noticed that the craftsman doing the presentation had a LN block plane on his bench.  He used the plane continually throughout the demonstration.  At the end of the class I went up and asked him if I could take a look at his block plane.  He swore by it, and said that it was the best block plane he had ever owned.  I was impressed with it.  The man let me take a few passes with it on some scrap and I knew that I’d like to have one.  Talk about a tool that feels great in your hand.  The LN was inspired by the Stanley #60 and # 60 ½ block planes.  LN did make improvements to the pressure cap, and thickness of the main casting.  It’s a heavy plane for its size.  The iron is thicker, and there’s no slop in its adjusting mechanism whatsoever.  As evidenced by the shavings, the plane can be easily set up for an aggressive pass, medium work, or a shaving that’s whisper thin.  It’s a nice tool.  Since 1999, not one project has crossed my bench where the plane depicted below hasn’t touched the work piece at least once or twice.  Any tool can be a part of the wood working experience.  Hopefully the tool will provide utility, inspiration and satisfaction.  This particular plane brings me all three every time I use it.

Jim C.             
« Last Edit: April 19, 2014, 08:06:49 AM by Jim C. »
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Offline Bill Houghton

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #271 on: April 19, 2014, 02:57:14 AM »
I've never used a metal butt mortise plane, but I made one, and I agree: they're the cat's fuzzy PJs for hinge mortises and similar shallow mortises).  I posted an article on how I made mine on Wood Central, at http://woodcentral.com/articles/handtools/articles_114.shtml (Papaw: I hope it's OK to refer to other fora here; if not, I'll delete this reference).

Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #272 on: April 19, 2014, 07:49:55 AM »
Wow Bill!!!!  Your butt mortise plane is really GREAT!!!!  First off, you did a fantastic job making a useful tool.  Second, your writeup and photos are outstanding.  What a great article you put together!  I strongly encourage everyone to check it out.  I think you've been holding out on us.  What other planes have you made?  You know it's funny, because I never know for sure who's reading this stuff.  I've come to conclude that at least a few of the "regulars" like Branson and Scottg are serious hand plane (and other hand tool) users/enthusiasts/authorities.  Their comments, photos, and observations have added a lot to the thread, and I appreciate their contributions.  After seeing and reading about your butt mortise plane, you're being added to the list.  You've been laying low.......but no longer my friend.  I hope to be hearing more from you as the thread grows.  Thanks for presenting some practical, useful content.  Great stuff!!!!

Jim C.       
« Last Edit: April 19, 2014, 08:48:16 PM by Jim C. »
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Offline Papaw

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #273 on: April 19, 2014, 08:25:01 AM »
I agree, Bill, you have been holding out on us!
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Offline bird

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #274 on: April 19, 2014, 10:46:01 AM »
How the heck haven't I been in on this thread?? I'm so glad you folks posted some new stuff so that I found it!  Wow, what a wealth of information!! Cheers to the woodworkers amongst us!!!!!
       For those of you that didn't know, I'm a chef by trade. I got out of the business for many reasons and now survive off of woodworking, the ocasional catering jobs, ect.  .... much poorer and happier now.
     I don't see that much difference in the two trades. Your food can only be as good as the quality of meat, vegies, fish, ect. that you buy. That is the first step. Your woodworking will only be as good as the piece of wood you have to work with. I cannot execute my job without the right tools. I have to have the right knive for the job. Cooking with a dull, inferior knife is a bad idea. Working with dull chisels, blades, ect. leads to dissapointment and injury.
       But, I can buy the best chefs knife there is.  It's useless unless I know how to take care of it. For anyone that's tried to use a handplane once or twice and given up or found it useless, try again. Tune it up right, and know that it takes a lot of practice to get the best results. Before you know it, you will be using one instead of setting up some complicated jig for one of your powered machines because it's a lot quicker in certain jobs.
    When I started woodworking I made a pact with myself. I would always master things with hand tools before using any power tools.
Once you have the tools, you have to understand the grain, read the peice of wood, know how it likes to fit together--- moisture, what enviorment it's happiest in, ect.  Food is the same way. You don't cook all fish the same way. You don't throw just any herb in anything. It all has to fit together, like a well made joint.
       Next is something then people can learn to a certain degree, but I think in some people, creativity is something that comes naturally.  I can't read a recipe worth a damn and I can't follow someone elses wood plans either. But, that's a topic for another time. Thanks for sharing !!!!!
cheers,
bird.
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Offline Bill Houghton

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #275 on: April 19, 2014, 10:56:47 AM »
Jim C. and Papaw,

Thanks for the praise, although I've never seen that plane as anything but a quick tool to get a job done.  Certainly not up to Scott's standards.

That butt mortise plane is the only one I've made.  Other planes - bench, router, etc. - are so easy to come by that I'm not motivated to spend time on rolling my own.  I've seen some of the user-made specialized joinery planes, like those for grooving the bottom of door parts; those would make sense if I were doing lots of casework.  But for what I've been doing, no need.  On the other hand, the mortise plane solved a problem, and, since I've never seen one in the wild, I had to make it.

Bill
« Last Edit: April 19, 2014, 11:04:00 AM by Bill Houghton »

Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #276 on: April 19, 2014, 05:00:40 PM »
How the heck haven't I been in on this thread?? I'm so glad you folks posted some new stuff so that I found it!  Wow, what a wealth of information!! Cheers to the woodworkers amongst us!!!!!
       For those of you that didn't know, I'm a chef by trade. I got out of the business for many reasons and now survive off of woodworking, the ocasional catering jobs, ect.  .... much poorer and happier now.
     I don't see that much difference in the two trades. Your food can only be as good as the quality of meat, vegies, fish, ect. that you buy. That is the first step. Your woodworking will only be as good as the piece of wood you have to work with. I cannot execute my job without the right tools. I have to have the right knive for the job. Cooking with a dull, inferior knife is a bad idea. Working with dull chisels, blades, ect. leads to dissapointment and injury.
       But, I can buy the best chefs knife there is.  It's useless unless I know how to take care of it. For anyone that's tried to use a handplane once or twice and given up or found it useless, try again. Tune it up right, and know that it takes a lot of practice to get the best results. Before you know it, you will be using one instead of setting up some complicated jig for one of your powered machines because it's a lot quicker in certain jobs.
    When I started woodworking I made a pact with myself. I would always master things with hand tools before using any power tools.
Once you have the tools, you have to understand the grain, read the peice of wood, know how it likes to fit together--- moisture, what enviorment it's happiest in, ect.  Food is the same way. You don't cook all fish the same way. You don't throw just any herb in anything. It all has to fit together, like a well made joint.
       Next is something then people can learn to a certain degree, but I think in some people, creativity is something that comes naturally.  I can't read a recipe worth a damn and I can't follow someone elses wood plans either. But, that's a topic for another time. Thanks for sharing !!!!!
cheers,
bird.

Hi Bird!  I'm glad you found the thread.  Welcome aboard.  I hope you'll be a frequent visitor and contributor.  Jump in and join the conversation any time. 

Jim C.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2014, 05:08:44 PM by Jim C. »
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Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #277 on: April 19, 2014, 05:21:26 PM »
Bill,

Whether that was the first plane you made or your one hundredth, you still did a really nice job on it.  Your writeup was equally well done.  Thanks again for adding the outstanding content to the thread.  Keep it coming!

Jim C.   
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Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #278 on: April 28, 2014, 11:35:47 PM »
About a month ago, I responded to a post from John (johnsironsanctuary) regarding my interest in hand planes.  (See page 17, reply #240)  I recall that John asked me how I got into collecting and I mentioned that I met a very nice man who sort of mentored me and got me on the path to collecting.  When I met this man, I was already a dedicated hand plane user and someone who frequently bought old planes to help me along with my projects.  In my response to John, I mentioned that my friend and I spoke frequently, although I never met him in person.  That didn’t stop us from enjoying our conversations on the phone and sending emails back and forth with photos of our most recent tool additions.   Somewhere along the line, I started acquiring planes from my friend, and as a result, the composition of my collection changed.  After a few years, I was a collector in every sense of the word.   I don’t regret that, and I certainly don’t apologize for it. 

You might recall that in my response to John, I mentioned that my old friend died a couple years ago.  Shortly before he passed, we talked about his collection and the lifetime he had spent putting it together.  It was truly a first rate collection of antique tools that were produced in a golden age of American industrial ambition.  He shared some stories about a few of the planes and the circumstances in which they had come into his possession.  Some of the stories I had heard before, and others were new to me.  Some of the planes had come to him from friends who had passed.  I just listened.  Near the end of the conversation, he wondered what would become of his collection.  Thinking that he had already come to a conclusion, I still said nothing and listened.  After a moment or two of silence, he finally spoke and said that the planes were only his to preserve for a certain period of time.  He was dedicated to their history, and when the time came, he hoped that they would be passed on to the next fellow, who in turn would preserve them, protect them, and eventually pass them on to someone else.  More than anything else that I learned about collecting old Stanley hand planes from my friend, I learned that I’m just a custodian of a small segment of tools from our great industrial past.  MANY of the planes in my collection came from my friend’s collection, either during his lifetime, or after, and now I am their custodian.  When the time comes, they’ll pass to someone else, or be dispersed to other collections.   

Jim C.             
« Last Edit: September 11, 2020, 07:42:50 AM by Jim C. »
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Offline Lewill2

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #279 on: April 29, 2014, 06:40:38 AM »
That is a great looking tool room!

Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #280 on: April 29, 2014, 08:25:01 AM »
That is a great looking tool room!

The photo really doesn't do the room or the collection justice.  I tried to post a larger photo, but the website would not accept it.  I have a few more that I'll try to post at some point down the road.  I was looking through a few photos last night and thought some here would be interested in seeing just how advanced some collections can be.  I'm sure there are similar collections of wrenches, saws, hammers, etc. that others have spent years piecing together.  The photo I posted only depicts SOME of the collection.  Other angles into the room reveal that there is a lot more.  It’s truly a mini museum of sorts.  Even to someone with a casual interest, the collection is impressive. 

Jim C.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2023, 07:15:30 PM by Jim C. »
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Offline Lewill2

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #281 on: April 29, 2014, 12:32:19 PM »
Jim, The link below is of an old thread where I posted some pictures from my tool room. The plow planes I have in my collection are display items only. I never used any of them. I was always intrigued how each maker had his own take on the details of their plane. Nut profiles and arm support profiles vary between makers.

I enjoy this thread for all the info that has been shared.
Les

http://www.papawswrench.com/vboard/index.php?topic=102.msg423#msg423

Offline Jim C.

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #282 on: April 29, 2014, 01:43:16 PM »
Wow Les!! I mean seriously.... WOW!!  Yet another guy reading this thread who has been laying low "sand bagging" it.  What have you been waiting for?  I love old plow planes, and your collection is absolutely amazing!!  The wrenches are great too.  I'm pretty sure that we'd all like to see a lot more of your collection.  Is there any chance that you could feature a plow plane here every once in a while?  Maybe a few pictures, with a short write up and a little history?  I really hope you'll consider my request.  Great collection!  I'd love to see more of it.

Jim C.     
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Offline oldtools

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #283 on: April 29, 2014, 03:32:00 PM »
WOW! Les!!! Amazing collection & display, Looks like they belong in a museum!! 
Jim, your collection is impressive!
Aloha!  the OldTool guy
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Offline turnnut

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Re: Hand Planes
« Reply #284 on: April 29, 2014, 09:00:01 PM »
that is a very wonderful private, cared for museum owned & managed by Les.

very nice, Frank