Tool Talk
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: amecks on August 12, 2014, 08:11:07 AM
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Came across this in my garage in a box of unsorted hardware. Swaging Punch 93-S (5/8"). I only have this one. How are these used and for what purpose?
Thanks.
Al
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They are used to expand the end of a piece of copper tubing so that another piece can be joined to it without the need of a union fitting. You'll also only need to sweat one join instead of two like on a union.
You just tap the swaging tool into the end of the tubing with a hammer...
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soft copper on a roll, if it is I/E iy is most likely O.D. size rating refer sizes.
the sticks are hard they don't like the swaged
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A swage for hard tube is mechanical. It has two arms like a limb lopper, except the business end swages a coupling instead of cutting a tree limb.
You usually braze swaged ends- the joint is too loose for copper.
Another swage flares the end of the tube back. They are like flare tools for bigger size tubes.
Chilly
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Here's a link to the appropriate Imperial site:
http://imperial-tools.com/products/swaging-tools
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Got it! Thanks! Probably not something I need as there's no copper plumbing in my home - it's all PEX.
Al.
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Al, what is "PEX?" Thanks.
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It's a soft pkastic tube that fits up with special crimp on fittings.
Here is a link to one person's install:
http://ryan.boren.me/2011/12/26/pex-plumbing/
Chilly
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Chilly, thank you. Me, I'm a copper-prone fellow when it comes to water delivery but I can understand why plastics appeal to lots.
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Chilly, thank you. Me, I'm a copper-prone fellow when it comes to water delivery but I can understand why plastics appeal to lots.
If I was installing fire sprinklers in my own house, and money was no object, I would use copper.
We used to use a lot of copper. Now its almost all CPVC. Money.
Chilly
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Sprinkler fitters should never be listened to when it comes to copper, they got too much iron in their blood.
Swaging is nearly a lost skill. Everything today is minimize labor for profit.
A swage & holding block will give you a female fitting in a minute, but today's "plumber" would rather walk to the truck for a coupling.
Swaging works well with copper & solder, but must be done absolutely right for brass. Brass will only span .012".
If the fit ain't tight brass will pinhole.
The correct Brass MUST be used with some new gases because they will erode solder. Wrong alloy can lead to erosion over time as well.
Any copper being brazed or silver soldered MUST be flowed with Nitrogen to prevent internal contamination and flaking!
Pex is Cross Latched Polyethylene
In 2014 we have a cement for copper and ss tube systems that outperforms solder.
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Sprinkler fitters should never be listened to when it comes to copper, they got too much iron in their blood.
That's what gives us that special aroma.
I know its true, well except for our residential crews. They're exposed to too much of that glue while installing CPVC.
While an apprentice I worked mostly copper for 2 or 3 yrs. Plumbers (well the good ones anyway) complained that we used too much heat while soldering. I am sure they were right.
Chilly
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I watched a tin knocker "teaching" his helper how to slobber copper a year ago. I flat out told him he should be ashamed of the way he was teaching the kid to slop solder around, and more ashamed of calling himself a mechanic.
Sent the kid for some chalk, a really hard find on a school job by the way. I taught both of them how it's done.
PVC is a wonderful thing, but as you say the glue is hell.
Far as residential sprinklers are concerned you'd play hell selling them here. How much sprinkle are you going to get out of a 5/8 copper service line anyhow?
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Far as residential sprinklers are concerned you'd play hell selling them here. How much sprinkle are you going to get out of a 5/8 copper service line anyhow?
Enough to save your life if a fire started. Single family design is generally based on life safety, giving occupants enough time to get out. Design is based on 2 heads operating. Demand is usually less than 30 gpm, and you need a 10 minute supply. 300 gallon tank w/ a pump to get it delivered does the trick.
As of 2011 all single family homes would have fire sprinklers if jurisdictions adopt the international residential code and don't exclude that part. It will eventually be adopted everywhere.
Most people think they could get stuff and get out if their home was on fire. Whole homes take just a few minutes to be totally burn down. Or worse, flash over after 2 or 3 minutes and have temperatures over 2000° melt all their switch-plates and wiring, along with everything else.
Its tough, like seat belts were.
Okay, stepping down off my soapbox,,.,.,.
Chilly
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Fellow here who was Mr Fire Chief and in the HVAC business added residential sprinklers to his product line 20 years back. He died last year with 95% of his initial inventory still in stock.
We get a cold winter more sprinkler lines split than work largely due to them being located wrong. 8 miles from my place the school district installed sprinklers in the aquatic center with the help of S#itplex. If that pool ever lights off they have it sprinkled.
Would I like to have sprinklers in my steel building? Yes. I don't have the water though and I ain't spending money like the fool water company wants to run water in from the road.
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> sprinklers in the aquatic center
I was working in the bathroom at a dorm today. There was an area with showers.
Four shower heads, 2 sprinkler heads......
Go figure.....
If your tile shower is on fire, you have real serious problems that a sprinkler isn't gonna fix ;P
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You wouldn't believe the damage one flaming co-ed can wreak.
If they would just stop, drop, and roll we could catch them and stomp the fire out..... :embarrassed:
Chilly
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Chilly, I think it was 1977 when my partner and I heard a story the radio about how researchers in California (Ayup; just don't say it!) had found that PVC gave off carcinogens from the physical flow of water. I commented to my pard, maybe we'll be hired to go back and replace PVC with copper again? (We'd already been paid to do the reverse a few times.) He said, bet against it. The petro-industry ain't gonna let their piping go. I heard the very same story again on the radio in the mid-1990s…, and sighed. Anyway, my concern is the chemicals I'm encouraged to ingest in water (Chlorine is one) and food. I've already gotten rid of 2 cancers and am working on a third. I'll stick with "natural" stuff. My health is worth more than saving a few bucks on materials.
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Copper isn't all that nice either tho, several copper compounds, including the chlorides produced in slight quantities by the chlorine in the water are also toxic, and then there is all that lead based solder used for decades and decades....
I think they have actully changed the plasticizers in PVC because of issues with the old ones. I don't know if the new ones are any better, perhaps. We seem to have this thing about coming out with 'new and improved' and then finding out a decade later that it wasn't quite as improved as we thought....;P