Tool Talk
Wrench Forum => Wrench Forum => Topic started by: OilyRascal on July 13, 2012, 12:55:57 PM
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Mr. lbgradwell had me in the mood to dig through adjustable wrenches today. I was able to capture a few pictures while I had them out. These are adjustable wrenches I have acquired via purchasing over time that have been hung on the garage wall w/o cleaning and w/o use. It does not represent my workers, those I've inhereited, or those from the "Oily Shop" (in other words - all trade candidates minus Thorsen and Nye). I will capture the others as well sometime in the near future. Enjoy, and please don't beat me up because I've not yet cleaned them.
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_117681_.jpg)
Craftsman (my apology for crap picture will snap another if someone needs/wants)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_117683_.jpg)
Thorsen, Thorsen/Allied, and Allied
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_117684_.jpg)
Nye Tool (previously posted but again for the sake of grouping)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_117685_.jpg)
Williams
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_117686_.jpg)
Miscellanious (from the top: Sparta 12", Power-Kraft 12", Blue-Grass 10", Task Force 10", Herbrand 10", Ridgid 8", Malco 8", Kraeuter 8", Unknown maker - German made 8", Fuller 8", Wizard 6" (which I should have already given to my dad).
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_117687_.jpg)
Proto (3x 10", 3x 8", 2x 6")
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_117688_.jpg)
Diamond
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_117689_.jpg)
Crescent
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_117690_.jpg)
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Nice collection!
(Now get out there & clean them up...)
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I almost neglected two that sit on my desk. One from Papaw (non-working) the larger 2-1/2" does work though I'm not proud of it's COO.
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_117750_.jpg)
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No wonder I can't find any :-) nice collection.
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MR. SPUR WHAT ARE YOU LOOKING FOR i have boxes and boxes of over 6 in that i will trade or sell . As most here know i am interested in all 4 in and under bob w.
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I almost neglected two that sit on my desk. One from Papaw (non-working) the larger 2-1/2" does work though I'm not proud of it's COO.
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_117750_.jpg)
What is the mfg. of the 1/2 inch adj? bob w.
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A few more adjustable wrenches that missed the round-up yesterday.
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_119054_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_119055_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_119065_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_119066_.jpg)
AND several duel marked
Garrett Supply / J.H. Williams
Proto / Plvmb
Fleet / Penens (7/22 Edit to correct spelling of Penens)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_119067_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_119068_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_119069_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_119070_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_119071_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_119072_.jpg)
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My meeger collection pales next to this. Most of what I have are users.... most of them were found, several along the roadside. Now there's an idea...what tools have you guys found along the road?
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I found a hand type tool box with snap-on tools ScatTered all over . I took about a half hour to pick up the tools -- missing about 6 sockets FROM 1/4,,3/8,,1/2 sets of ratchet ext ans sockets and about 20 wrenches, hammer pliers and several screwdrivers. I advertised on cl having found a box of valuables on that road. I GOT SEVERAL CALLS SAYING MY JEWRLY BOX WITH JEWLRY IN IT WAS LOST ON THAT ROAD ONE CRAFTSMAN TOOL BOX WITH CRAFTSMAN TOOLS,OND ONE LOST A LOCK BOX WITH IMPORTANT PAPERS. after a month MY SON ENDED UP WITH THE TOOLS AFTER I FILLED IN THE MISSING SOCKETS NEW FROM THE SNAP-ON TRUCK. BOB W.
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Along the roadside, or in the street, not a lot but. Asian import visegrip like tool, went back to get it thinking it was made here in Nebraska, no such luck. Snapon 7/16 boxend wrench, SK 1/2in. wrench. Ten inch crescent sticking out of my muddy road, still have it, some,,, uhmm, years later. Best find was a black finish, Snapon 1-1/4 combo end wrench. Second best find was a Snapon 3/4in. drive socket, about 1.5 inch, right between some shops, I spent a few minutes asking around, could find no owner. Sorry thats all I've found.
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Not ON the road, but IN the road, I found an old pick head, and dug it the rest of the way out. Happened about 50 years ago, and I still have it somewhere. Also not on the road, but found lying about was an old Kentucky bit ax head. It was on the ground, no sign of a handle, in an old abandoned graveyard in the mountains. I put a straight handle on it and used it at Sutter's Fort for years. Still got it too.
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I found this 8 inch Diamond Calk Horse Shoe Co. adjustable in January, 1954 in a snowbank alongside the roadway of the old Western Gateway Bridge that took NY Route 5 from Schenectady across the Mohawk River to Scotia and beyond. I cycled across that bridge's sidewalk twice a day to get to school and back home.
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I found this 8 inch Diamond Calk Horse Shoe Co. adjustable in January, 1954 in a snowbank alongside the roadway of the old Western Gateway Bridge that took NY Route 5 from Schenectady to Scotia and beyond. I cycled across that bridge's sidewalk twice a day to get to school and back home.
You have some serious class!
ONE of the things I realized, only after putting the Diamond's side-by-side, was distinct changes in the logo of wrenches; specifically the presence or absence of a "T" or Hammer looking markings inside the triangle in the logo. I note yours has it present. I could not find information explaining it or it's timeline.
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ONE of the things I realized, only after putting the Diamond's side-by-side, was distinct changes in the logo of wrenches; specifically the presence or absence of a "T" or Hammer looking markings inside the triangle in the logo. I note yours has it present. I could not find information explaining it or it's timeline.
The T/Hammer is supposed to represent a calk. The logo changed when the name changed in 1958...
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Rascal:
Thanks for the kind remark! My take on the little embossed mark within the horse shoe is that it is a calk. See the picture below, and see if you agree.
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See the picture below, and see if you agree.
If the threaded portion were obscured it would certainly fit the profile.
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Rascal:
The diemaker working on the calk portion of the stamping die probably thought the outline of a calk would do the job.
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Oily, I am amazed that with the vast selection of Craftsman and Williams that you didn't turn up one with the patent locking pin feature.
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The interesting thing is that I recall seeing one with markings that would have indicated it would be present, but it was not. I can't recall off the top of my head what exactly the marking said, but something along the lines of "lock pin" - but again, I could find no difference in how it was cast other than the markings.
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The Craftsman version is marked AZ in a circle near the thumbwheel on the handle inset. I can't find any distinguishing marks on the Williams, but I have never actually seen one. It appears to be the same markings as the ordinary Superadjustable You can only see one side of the handle in the catalog.
(http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb373/johnsironsanctuary/Williams%20Catalog%20305/scan0007.jpg)
The pin sticks out of either the top or bottom of the thumbwheel. I believe that the pin is round for most of it's length and has a hex feature under the head at the bottom end. I don't think that a regular screw pin could replace the lock pin. I see by the parts kit on the catalog page that there is a snap ring holding the pin. I have not disassembled it.
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My Lock-A-Just Superjustable (no "a" John!):
(http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c180/lbgradwell/JHWilliamsSuperjustable-1.jpg)
The pin seems to be a hex...
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A hex? Why would they make it a hex?
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Steel rods come in 4 basic shapes , round (like a drill), square, flat, and hex, so it was probably as much expedient as anything else. All it needs to do is not rotate....
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My Lock-A-Just Superjustable (no "a" John!)
LOL! No "d" either. D'uh.
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My Lock-A-Just Superjustable (no "a" John!)
LOL! No "d" either. D'uh.
LOL - I saw that, but didn't want to call you out. I know how you get with newbs :)~~~~
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LOL - I saw that, but didn't want to call you out. I know how you get with newbs :)~~~~
Haha! I never mind being corrected; we should all be seeking better info...
You saw that, huh? I try to avoid stuff like that but some people just beg to feel the lash...
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WOW now thats some adjustables you got.
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A few more added to the collection; from the top:
2 Crescent Crestoloy 8" - one with Jamestown NY markings
Craftsman 10"
Snap-on AD6 6" (I'm not a snappy guy, but for a $1)
Thorsen-Allied AW6AL 6" (was needed for the display board - another one down)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_131191_.jpg)
and a 15" Challenger "ClikStop"
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_131172_.jpg)
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Snap-on AD6 6" (I'm not a snappy guy, but for a $1)
Absolutely! I really like that older logo & it looks to be in very good condition...
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Tell me about that Challenger Clikstop - does the name have something to do with the way that worm axle sticks out?
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u got any extra international harvester 8" and 6" adjustables? i been looking over 15 year for them i can afford. i got the 12" and 10"ones.
thanks.
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I checked, and I have no extra 8-incher IHC adjustables. If I see any, I'll buy them and let you know ASAP.
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Wrenchmensch: Are you talking about the "monkey wrench" IHC or ones like a modern Crescent?
I have an International Harvester 8" laying out on my front porch, I think! I need to clean that puppy up.
OilyRascal: I think I've seen that black oxide finish Thorsen 8" with the sharp crisp modern lines somewhere before, just can't remember where....;) ;).....lol.
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Tell me about that Challenger Clikstop - does the name have something to do with the way that worm axle sticks out?
No, I don't think so; not sure what's going on with Oily's wrench...
I'm reasonably sure the Clik-Stop feature was introduced in 1957 or 1958. That is, Clik-Stop wrenches do not appear in the 1956 Proto catalogue, but I have an ad from 1958 so...
Clik-Stop wrenches were available from Proto, Challenger and P&C for certain, and I would not be surprised if the were offered in other Pendleton brands too.
Year unknown:
(http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c180/lbgradwell/Plomb-Proto1950sClik-StopBrochure.jpg)
1959:
(http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c180/lbgradwell/Plomb-Proto1959Clik-Stop.jpg)
(http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c180/lbgradwell/PC1959Clik-Stop.jpg)
1963:
(http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c180/lbgradwell/PC1963.jpg)
They are still offered by Proto today.
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Cool advertisements, LG!!
I have a pair of P&C water pump pliers on eBay right now. Kinda cool to see them in an original ad!!
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Wrenchmensch: Are you talking about the "monkey wrench" IHC or ones like a modern Crescent?
[/color]
Keykeeper: I am talking about the ones (both Z 788's) below.
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Wrenchmensch:
Ok, now I know. I don't think I have ever seen one of those "in the wild" tool hunting. I'll keep my eyes open, though.
I measured the IHC I have, it is actually 9 inches long. Good condition though. I'm gonna put it in my monkey wrench collection. My brother actually found it in some junk he hauled out for someone. I have it's bigger brother somewhere around here, I think.
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I have a pair of P&C water pump pliers on eBay right now.
Link? Can't find 'em...
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Tell me about that Challenger Clikstop - does the name have something to do with the way that worm axle sticks out?
I wish I could. Learning myself.
u got any extra international harvester 8" and 6" adjustables? i been looking over 15 year for them i can afford. i got the 12" and 10"ones.
thanks.
No, sir! I will keep my eyes peeled for you. Good luck in your hunt! Please show off those you have. I'd love to see them.
OilyRascal: I think I've seen that black oxide finish Thorsen 8" with the sharp crisp modern lines somewhere before, just can't remember where....;) ;).....lol.
Yes Sir you have :-) Many many thanks! Much of what I have Thorsen has come from this community.
No, I don't think so; not sure what's going on with Oily's wrench...
I'm not sure myself. It is "frozen" at the moment. I need to spend some time with it and see if I can free it up and figure out how it functions. More to come.
PS - thanks for the adverts.
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From the wild today - marked "Toyota Motor" on one shank, and "Angle Wrench" on the other.
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_132437_.jpg)
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Crescent 4" Jamestown NY USA markings
John Deere TY19945 6"
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_132695_.jpg)
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Does the Crescent 4 incher actually say "Made in USA" on the other side? Or just "Crescent Tool Company Jamestown NY"
By the way. I rue the day that I missed this auction....
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&_trksid=p4340.l2557&item=320932910756&nma=true&rt=nc&si=qJwoW0Q8dKVfQMsBhXZExDIIEbk%253D&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&_trksid=p4340.l2557&item=320932910756&nma=true&rt=nc&si=qJwoW0Q8dKVfQMsBhXZExDIIEbk%253D&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc)
2 NYE adjustable wrenches 12", 10" made in Chicago Illinois vintage tools wrench
Item condition: --
Ended: Jul 01, 201215:17:23 PDT
Starting bid: US $19.99
[ 0 bids ]
Had planned on bidding but somehow forgot. When they came up again I saw that there were bidders and was too broke to feel competitive.
Congratulations of winning them! They seem to get cooler every time I look at the pictures.
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Does the Crescent 4 incher actually say "Made in USA" on the other side? Or just "Crescent Tool Company Jamestown NY"
It is marked "Crescent Tool Co. Jamestown N.Y., U.S.A."
Congratulations of winning them!
Thanks!
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Clik-Stop wrenches were available from Proto, Challenger and P&C for certain, and I would not be surprised if they were offered in other Pendleton brands too.
We can add Vlchek to the list. This photo is from AA:
(http://home.comcast.net/~alloy-artifacts/Photos/tools/vlchek_adj_av6_f_cropped_inset_w560_h240.jpg)
The patent was applied for September 9, 1957 and finally issued almost exactly two years later on September 22, 1959.
In addition, AA notes:
This wrench closely resembles Proto adjustable wrenches, but more importantly, the "Clik-Stop" trademark was registered in 1958 by Pendleton Tool Industries, the parent company for Proto in the 1950s. Similarly, the "Clik-Stop" mechanism is covered by patent #2,905,037, issued to C.W. Coslow in 1959 with assignment to Pendleton Tool Industries.
The Clik-Stop mark has been used on Proto and related brands for years, so it's clear that this wrench is a Proto product. (More accurately, the wrench was made by the J.P. Danielson division of Pendleton Tool Industries, the factory responsible for adjustable wrench production.)
Elsewhere, AA claims:
Pendleton Tool Industries registered the "Clik-Stop" trademark with the first use in 1957...
http://www.google.com/patents?vid=USPAT2905037 (http://www.google.com/patents?vid=USPAT2905037)
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By the way, did anyone else notice the P&C logo had changed somewhere between 1959 and 1963?
Not only are the letters bolder, the style of the ampersand has changed too!
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Congratulations of winning them!
Thanks!
Nice deal too!
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From the top:
8" Irega No. 77 - Spain
10" Mack - USA
6" Indestro Super 3587
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_133547_.jpg)
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8" Craftsman 44603
8" Westline H5052 - Japan
6" Fuller #6 - Japan
4" Crescent Crestoloy
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_133556_.jpg)
12" Betr-grip
10" Crescent "Jamestown, N.Y., USA" markings
10" Truecraft Tool - Japan
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_133565_.jpg)
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Snap-on AD6 6" (I'm not a snappy guy, but for a $1)
Absolutely! I really like that older logo & it looks to be in very good condition...
It is in fine condition. Not a chip off the chrome....not even on the flats. Smooth movement. No slack. The "H-Beam" shank has nice feel for me. The weight feels substantial for a 6" at 4 ounces. I've been carrying it in the pocket since I've had it. I can not deny it is easy to see why their brand brings a premium.
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Anybody else have a Poly-Lock?
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"It is marked "Crescent Tool Co. Jamestown N.Y., U.S.A."- OilyRascal
Thanks for checking that for me. I really like your 6" Plomb/Proto along with many others.
Here is a poor attempt at a picture of how the Clik-Stop works...
(http://photos.foxgti.com/i.ashx?&mid=55651046&mt=Photo&standardsize=1143x814)
The knurl spring holds the knurl tight against the opposing teeth(or tooth). I hope that is evident in this picture.
Here is a picture of my Clik-Stops.
http://photos.foxgti.com/i.ashx?gallery=1013514&mid=55651047&mt=Photo&standardsize=1183x654 (http://photos.foxgti.com/i.ashx?gallery=1013514&mid=55651047&mt=Photo&standardsize=1183x654)
The P&C has the patent number on it and has a date code of U-4-8. The date code on the 8" Vlchek is N-10-1.
The date code on the 6" Vlchek is P-11-1.
http://photos.foxgti.com/i.ashx?gallery=1013514&mid=55651048&mt=Photo&standardsize=1123x842 (http://photos.foxgti.com/i.ashx?gallery=1013514&mid=55651048&mt=Photo&standardsize=1123x842)
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A 6" Diamond - absent the green plastic coating
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_143419_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_143446_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_143448_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_143453_.jpg)
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6" Channellock 806 with markings "6 In. - 150 MM CHANNELLOCK Made in U.S.A." on one shank with "806 Channellock Inc. Meadville, PA. Forged Steel"
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_145707_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_145708_.jpg)
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A better look at the Kraeuter 8" after cleaning and by itself. It has a 1" flat-to-flat max opening, 8-1/8" long, 8.2 ounces, with markings of "8 IN. KRAEUTER DEFIANCE OHIO" with Defiance over Ohio. It also has casting marks of "L" and "C" on the shank just near the hanging hole. On the opposite shank it is marked "8 IN. Forged Alloy in U.S.A" with a casting mark of "J" near the hanging hole.
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_146984_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_146989_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_146993_.jpg)
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A better look at the Kraeuter 8" after cleaning and by itself. It has a 1" flat-to-flat max opening, 8-1/8" long, 8.2 ounces, with markings of "8 IN. KRAEUTER DEFIANCE OHIO" with Defiance over Ohio. It also has casting marks of "L" and "C" on the shank just near the hanging hole. On the opposite shank it is marked "8 IN. Forged Alloy in U.S.A" with a casting mark of "J" near the hanging hole.
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_146984_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_146989_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_146993_.jpg)
Manufactured at SK's plant, Defiance, Ohio.
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10" Craftsman - marked with an "AZ" in a circle logo, and "Patd in USA" - this one featuring a hard stop
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_168647_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_168648_.jpg)
6" Craftsman - marked 944602
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_168649_.jpg)
8" Penens 4208 - marked with code "A-8-1"
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_168651_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_168652_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_168653_.jpg)
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Those two NYE wrenches appear to have been made by Proto. They have plain hang holes like Proto was making in the late 1940s and early 1950s. Also the forging marks are like Proto.
EvilDr235
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I noticed on some the wrenchs there is an arrow pointing in one direction,
like on the diamond wrench, what is that for?
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I noticed on some the wrenchs there is an arrow pointing in one direction,
like on the diamond wrench, what is that for?
It shows the direction in which you are supposed to pull the wrench; supposedly it ensures the most force is on the stronger static jaw.
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I noticed on some the wrenchs there is an arrow pointing in one direction,
like on the diamond wrench, what is that for?
It shows the direction in which you are supposed to pull the wrench; supposedly it ensures the most force is on the stronger static jaw.
Had the feeling that was gonna be the answer, wonder why only certain ones have them.
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wonder why only certain ones have them.
Because they are to be sold to users who don't know the correct way to use an adjustable.
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>the correct way to use an adjustable.
The small end is the handle, the large end is the hammer head..right?
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You got it!!!
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Anybody else have a Poly-Lock?
Lewill - That is an interesting looking wrench. Is there any information you could share re: "poly-lock"?
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Plomb me up Scotty...................
Hard to tell in my poor pic, but the hanger holes are also box end wrenches on the adjustables.
(The 4 inch was not in this pic for some reason. Will try to find it, and capture a pic with the 20 inch (not shown either) for fun.)
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Oily,
The circle AZ Craftsman was patented and made by JH Williams. The pin through the thumb screw locks the thumb screw when you push it upward. It unlocks when you push it back down. I have a couple of them, an 8 and a 15inch. I posted them a few months back. Below is the Williams Catalog page from 1962 or 63.
(http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb373/johnsironsanctuary/Williams%20Catalog%20305/scan0007.jpg)
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Posted in the Thorsen thread, but here also for the sake of grouping.
Thorsen 10" adjustable; model AW-10. Marked "AW-10 THORSEN" / "FORGED ALLOY STEEL USA".
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_182565_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_182568_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_182573_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_182574_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_182585_.jpg)
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Plomb me up Scotty...................
(The 4 inch was not in this pic for some reason. Will try to find it, and capture a pic with the 20 inch (not shown either) for fun.)
Found the 4" Plomb adjustable. The 20" Plomb is a 720 S . Jaws open to 2-1/2".
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Excellent!
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8" Urrea Model 708 - hecho en Mexico - I understand there is some connection to Proto where I should go educate myself on the details.
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_191805_.jpg)
(http://i1154.photobucket.com/albums/p534/alphinde/846471584_photobucket_191806_.jpg)