Need to find a small anvil.

[Branson]

A couple of us Civil War artificers are assembling a different set of tools.  Needing a set of proper artificer tools that can be packed into a van or pick up,
we're putting together a mountain howitzer set together.  These were designed to accompany the mountain howitzer, and like the howitzer, to be carried on pack animals.

We're waiting for the period drawings to arrive (we'll be building most of it) just now.  The thing is, this kit calls for a 35# anvil.  We'll need to find one.  Anything close will work for a start, probably.  The drawings should tell us about the size of the hardy and pritchel holes.  I'm assuming basic London pattern.

[1930]

Id like to see any pictures you can take

[Branson]

I'll work on pictures.  The portable forge for the mountain howitzer looks something like this portable forge but smaller.  This picture was taken on the deck of the Lehigh, one of the monitor class ships of the Civil War.

[keykeeper]

Judging by that picture, the anvil they are using is much more than 35#. Being on a ship, size probably didn't matter as much.

Do you think it will be London pattern, or maybe one of the smaller hornless style anvils? I know where one is sitting about that size, in front of a mans garage. No horn, just a very nice little stylized anvil with a hardy hole and obvious feet on it.

[mrchuck]

I know a stall in our "Big Daddy's" flea market here that is open Sat and Sun,, that has 2 small anvils.
One weighs about 15# and the other about 25 lbs.
Both have hardy holes.
Price listed on tag is 50 dollars for the bigger one and 30 on the smaller one.
Should I look further into this for you?? Take phone photo?

[Branson]

Judging by that picture, the anvil they are using is much more than 35#. Being on a ship, size probably didn't matter as much.

Do you think it will be London pattern, or maybe one of the smaller hornless style anvils? I know where one is sitting about that size, in front of a mans garage. No horn, just a very nice little stylized anvil with a hardy hole and obvious feet on it.

Yes, that \'s about a 275# anvil, looks to me.  The pack forge looks the same as the one on the Lehigh, but is a good deal smaller.

Since the largest part of the artificer's duties with the mountain howitzer would be shoeing the horses, I don't think a hornless anvil would be of much use.  Much the same system was used by mounted artillery batteries (as opposed to light artillery), and cavalry as well, and I know that the major use would have been horse shoeing.  Regulations held that every horse was to be re-shod each month.

The army bought Fisher anvils, Mousehole, and Hay Budden anvils.  I believe there were some Peter Wrights as well.  I have a picture of a 100# anvil riding in the bed of a traveling forge -- maybe I can crop it down and post it.  It's kinda clunky, certainly not as graceful as a Peter Wright. 

[Branson]

I know a stall in our "Big Daddy's" flea market here that is open Sat and Sun,, that has 2 small anvils.
One weighs about 15# and the other about 25 lbs.
Both have hardy holes.
Price listed on tag is 50 dollars for the bigger one and 30 on the smaller one.
Should I look further into this for you?? Take phone photo?

Could you get a picture, especially of the larger one?  I'd really appreciate it.

[amertrac]

Is this small enough ?  bob w.

[Branson]

Thanks for looking Bob.  It's probably small enough, but I got the drawings yesterday evening, and what appeared there is the strangest looking anvil and stand I have ever seen.  And the vise fits into the anvil's hardy hole.  I won't even try to describe this stuff.   A better quality set of measured drawings is on it's way, and we'll try to scan some images and post them here.   We will probably end up having to build the anvil...

Looks like we also get to find or make a double-edged hoof knife.  Yes, I did say double edged.  The Gov't contract hoof knives were ambidextrous tools. 

[Branson]

In part, the anvil looks like anvil b at this site.  Small, narrow, with a conical horn that isn't parallel with the table of the anvil.   To make it even more strange, it appears to be a stake anvil.  Since it is shown attached to the stand, it's not easy to tell.

http://www.anvilfire.com/anvils/ferd_anvil_004.php

Dimensions b.
    Height 10" x Width 2-1/2" x Length 15" (254 x 64 x 381 mm)
    Base = Length 9-1/2" x Width 7-3/4" (241 x 197 mm)
   Weight: 51 lbs. (23 kg)

Dimensions of anvil we're looking for:

>  The anvil is approximately 9" tall x 2 1/2" wide
>  and 9" in length
>  The anvil stand is approximately 18" tall with a
>  base that is 11" x 8"
>  Anvil and stand--38.5 lbs.

[Branson]

I know a stall in our "Big Daddy's" flea market here that is open Sat and Sun,, that has 2 small anvils.
One weighs about 15# and the other about 25 lbs.
Both have hardy holes.
Price listed on tag is 50 dollars for the bigger one and 30 on the smaller one.
Should I look further into this for you?? Take phone photo?

We now have a weight for the anvil itself -- 16 pounds.  There's going to be a lot of fabrication involved in
getting the exact form of the anvil, but one or the other of these anvils might be a good place to start.  If
you could get some pictures, that would be very helpful.

[mrchuck]

I will go check this coming Saturday morning, when they are open next,,,and if close, take photos.

[Branson]

I will go check this coming Saturday morning, when they are open next,,,and if close, take photos.

Thank you MrChuck!!

[anglesmith]

Branson, I would guess that you have seen the recent book on Civil war Blacksmithing by David Einhorn, but I mention it just in case you haven't.
Graeme

[Branson]

Branson, I would guess that you have seen the recent book on Civil war Blacksmithing by David Einhorn, but I mention it just in case you haven't.
Graeme

Thanks, Graeme, I have seen it listed, and I just looked through it online.  It doesn't really give me what I need, though.  I've been working on an original travelling forge for the past 11 years, and doing all the associated research in original documents.  What we are looking at now is reproducing/finding the portable forge used with the 1841 mountain howitzer.   

One fellow seems to be working at this a bit, but only one, and he seems to be taking some liberties from the original designs.  We've ordered some good Mordecai plans from the period and hope to accurately reproduce the whole thing.  The originals pack up entirely into four boxes that ride on pack saddles on two mules. 

The travelling forge carried a 100# anvil of common appearance -- pretty much a London pattern anvil.  The *portable forge* carried a 16 pound anvil.  It's dimensioned much like the cooper's beak-horn stake anvil pictured, but the appearance is quite a bit different, as you'll see once we get the proper drawings.